A good one from the bone yard.
new boy
JoinedPosts by new boy
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42
Why does it seem to be unhappy people who are attracted to the JWs?
by new boy ini have had time to think about this........... i was an attendent for many years.......... and looking up and down the rows at every family that was seating there in the khs........... no one was happy!.
i think of my mother (who brought this religion into our house)......she was one of the most unhappy and miserable people you would ever meet!
she was a spiritual orphan with few friends and no real family to speak of.. she got the "good news" back in 1950, that "the world" was a bad place and god, would soon be killing most everyone......she was thrilled!...............
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Guide to a Double Life: Don't Feel Guilty
by Hadriel infirst off lets be clear i wouldn't call it "double life" but rather life here today.
that said i'll give a little experience for those younger ones that may be thinking they wish to leave the organization but are too young to do so as they are under age.. field service was quite the regular occurrence in my household.
we never missed.
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new boy
Question how old are you? You sound like twenties or thirties. The reason I ask this question is.....are you going to keep this charade up for 30 to 40 years? It probably not going to happen. Sooner or later the wheels are going to fall off, no matter how clever you are.
Good luck!
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My Bethel Experience Part 13 "Love and Sex" at Bethel
by new boy inmost of us went back to bethel, thinking we wanted to make it our life long career, what better place to be right before 1975, when god was coming back to kick some ass?
that dream ended for the vast majority after just few months there, when they found out that something was very wrong.
otherwise why would anyone want to leave a spiritual paradise?
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new boy
Most of us went back to Bethel, thinking we wanted to make it our life long career, what better place to be right before 1975, when god was coming back to kick some ass? That dream ended for the vast majority after just few months there, when they found out that something was very wrong. Otherwise why would anyone want to leave a spiritual paradise? With only 2-5% staying after their 4 year commitment, and a very big percentage leaving before their time was even up. The average stay there in 1974 was only about 5 months. It was not a happy place, they were leaving in droves.
Getting a girlfriend and having sex, was looking better all the time. Hey! The Governing Body were doing it, all the bethel, the "heavies" were doing it. ....we wanted it too. Just why do you think Knorr got married? Did he get married for companionship? NO! There are over 1,500 "brothers" back there he could have that with them. He could do things with them ,sit around and talk about the bible.......or go to a movie .......there were plenty of "brown noses" for that.............Did he get married to have children?.....NO!.........it is forbidden to have children at bethel .......................Did he get married to be with that one person forever? No! He was going to Heaven and she wasn't. So why did he get married? It sure looks like good old....... S.E.X.......to me. Hey, even Germans like sex too.
So he and his buddies were able to enjoy that privilege. I say privilege, because not everyone was permitted to have it. Knorr came up with the rule (After he got married) that if you want to get married and stay at Bethel, you needed a total of 14 YEARS of full time service. So you were forbidden to get married for any reason for 4 years period, NO matter what, add another 10 years if you wanted to stay..........I didn't say FORBIDDEN did I? Opppsss, I guess I did. But the BIBLE says that only those that have "fallen away from the faith, would be FORBIDDING others to marry!" 1 Timothy 4:1-3..............so that can't be right.......Oppppss...I forgot the old double standard rule kicks in again, at this time! Another bethel Catch 22
They would say....... well you signed an agreement! Yes you’re 19 years old and you should have known what you were signing, right? Some would say. Well, you could always leave before your time. Yes, if you didn't mind the reproach and the shame and the punishment. Punishment for getting married? YES, the punishment for leaving before your time was up was, you could not pioneer for 6 months. So if you couldn’t pioneer you would lose your 4-D classification. That’s means in 1970 you would go back to a 1-A classification! S0 if you got called up, (The draft) guess what? You were going to jail!
There was NO! “Thank you, brother for the two years you did spend here.” There was “Bend over and get your prison uniform ready.”
So just why am I so upset about all of this. For one reason it caused plenty of hardship and heart ache. Plus all the unhappy marriages and all the unnecessary trips some poor souls had to make to the hookers on 8th Ave............and even DEATH to some ...as I will tell you about in my last chapter..........Come on guys....... Wouldn't you think, a LOVING organization would have peoples best interest at heart?...................as in "OH......Brother we are sorry to hear you are having a hard time here at Bethel..........and so you would like to leave?......GO, my friend and be in peace and may God be with you, and thank you for the time, you did spend here with us and of course, you can pioneer if you like"
But that sounds like something Jesus would say.
Oppssss ...........Did I say loving organization............Let me think.........Yes! I think it says somewhere in the Bible......."By their LOVE you would be able to recognize them"......boy isn't that true? There was no real love there. It started at the very top and worked its way down to the local KHs.
All the double standards......unwritten laws.......and bull shit.....it was just too much for most of us. I say most of us because, there are some there that LOVE that kind of bull shit and fit right it In. Yossairan said it in Catch 22..."Let the Bastards thrive!”
So most of us, we just wanted to find a little love and leave after out "tour of duty" was up. As the "brother" said.........."Just keep your mouth shut and do your job".........then get the hell out!
So, back to girlfriends and Bethelites...............As I mention, there was only one guy I knew, who had a girlfriend before he went to Bethel and "made his time" there, that was Roy Baty. Part of the reason for that, was she was only 15 years old when he went there, in 1970............So she was waiting for him and he was waiting for her….to grow up.
That was tough for guys like Roy with girl friends back home, because........you only got 2 weeks’ vacation a year, (you got no vacation your first year)............so you got a total of 6 weeks in 4 years..........many guys like myself, only got 4 weeks in 4 years. The reason being, Instead of taking our last two weeks’ vacation, we would just shorten our 4 year stay by two weeks. So I came on March 21, 1970............now, I could leave on March 7, 1974........The thought being, that any day NOT at Bethel........... WAS a vacation!
So that leaves us with our next group...........Guys that got girlfriends while they were at bethel. There were so many Bethelites in the New York City area that by the time you got there, anything decent was already "snapped up" years ago. Since many of the halls 10-20 bethelites in them, the competition was tough! With 60-70% of the halls being Black and Latino.........and 80% of the bethelites were white, the saying was "The longer you’re there.... the whiter they look." So it was a 14 year old white girl, or a good looking black sister....If you had a car the selection got a little better with upstate New York, Jersey or even New England. But for the vast majority it was the women from good old N.Y.C.
We saw it all too, every possible combination...... The 19 year old white guy from Iowa, getting married to the 36 year old, 250 lb. black sister with 2 teenagers 13 & 16, his step daughter was just 3 years younger than him! There were guys who got "caught in closets" with bethel housekeepers........Which was unusual because most of the sisters that were called to bethel, were beat with an ugly stick.
We joked about it and said that Knorr, once a month, would get all the applications of sisters, who wanted to cum at bethel (sorry, I meant come to bethel) He would get all the bethelites in the upper dining room and have a slide show. He would show a slide of some good looking pioneer sister from California and ask? How many of you guys want this sister to come to Bethel? The place would go crazy with noise..........he would throw the application away..................Next slide up was of some "Dog" from Iowa.....how many want this sister? You could hear a pin drop ......He would say.....call her in now..............I tell you that man was a genius.....he knew, what we were all about. For him good looking sisters just meant more problems.
I’ll had many sisters (even special pioneers) come up to me and ask me why they haven’t been called to bethel. I’d tell them. “You’re too attractive.” They thought I was kidding….nope!
There was a guy in the service dept. who ran off with DO wife..........There were married sisters who left their husbands for some single young bethel boy. You know all the stuff you would see in any Kingdom Hall.
Bethel tours were nice..............But most of time they were very sad.........You would see these great looking sisters go through on tour...............They would give you "the eye"...........You would give them "the eye"..........Then they would get on the bus and leave............No way to meet them.......Sometimes you would see them later that day in the Bethel home, hanging around with some "Nerd" from their home town........They might have asking the nerd "Don't you know any other Bethelites?” Sure they did but they were geeks too.
Sometimes it worked out great. I saw the love of my life. The lady I would marry, standing in front of the "ink room" in the summer of 1972 on a bethel tour!
More about love and sex at the big house tomorrow.
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My Bethel Experience Part 12
by new boy inthey say love is what makes the world go around.
at bethel, we "new boys" had a saying.
"if god created anything better then sex, he kept it for himself!".
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new boy
Sorry some of the tread got left out.
So ... that brings us to our Bethelities. Most of people that are called to Bethel, are single young men who are at their sexual peak. They signed a 4 year contract to stay at the house of god, no matter what. That means no sex, no matter what. So you can see we are going to have some very interesting things going on there.
Well were to start? We already talked about the gays and the NPGs.......plenty of those. The rest of the guys there, fall into different groups.
You had the guys who had girlfriends before they came. They asked the girls to wait for them. The odds of them making their time, were almost 0%. I knew of 1 guy that did that, in 4 years that way.
Guys that got girl friends in the New York area while they were there.
Guys that got together with a Bethel sister and married them.
Guys that got girl friends back home when they were on vacations.
Then of course there were some that just got a hooker on 8th Ave.
Guys that got no girlfriends but just masturbated a lot. Know it wasn’t legal.
We'll talk about them all on the next tread.
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My Bethel Experience Part 12
by new boy inthey say love is what makes the world go around.
at bethel, we "new boys" had a saying.
"if god created anything better then sex, he kept it for himself!".
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new boy
They say “love is what makes the world go around.” At Bethel, we "new boys" had a saying. "If God created anything better then SEX, he kept it for himself!"
How would we know? Most of us never had it. Didn't make any difference. We talked about it...........fantasied about it...........dreamt about it..........I' m sure because we couldn’t have it. That is why we glorified it so much. Hey! We were 20 years old and virgins! Some of us were in our 30's! We had some raging hormones going on.
Most of the guys who left Bethel, got married within a week after leaving the big house! I was different.....I waited 2 weeks! I had will power.......that’s not entirely true there was circuit assembly the week after so we had to wait a week.
Before we talk about sex at bethel............It would be good to talk about the history of sex in the organization. They would say that it started with Adam & Eve.......but the real organization is less than 150 years old. In reality it’s an 1800's religion, with an 1800's morals mentality. You know it got started back in the “The Victorian” period.
Anyway back in the Garden of Eden..........is where the real problem got started......in the organizations mind anyway.
The first real question ever posed...............Had nothing to do with universal sovereignty as the church would have you believe, it was about ..........Ever LASTING LIFE with God........... Or really GOOD SEX with a perfect wife for a few years........"Ahhhh............GOD I think I will take the sex please, thank you!!!!
Remember it said, “The man was NOT deceived!” He KNEW what he was doing..........in his mind the choice was clear..............everlasting life with god. A god who let’s face it, really wasn’t all that friendly, who was also invisible. Or he could chose a few wonderful years of bliss, with the woman of his dreams, the love of his life! A visible woman.
What a hero he was!!!!! ........He was the first man to die for LOVE and really GOOD SEX.........I say good sex because, who would give up everlasting life for an eternity of bad sex?........God didn't create no fool........What he did create, was a perfect man and a perfect woman, with a perfectly NORMAL and healthy sex drive.
P.S. I hate to break it to you but the whole Garden of Eden thing is pure urban myth.
Churches think that Adam should have chosen God over his wife ...... and the Jehovah’s Witnesses are no different. Religions are about control........and since most religions are run by self-righteous men with control and sexual issues........ Men who want to suppress women and sex, for control and power. Churches that say "the head of the woman is the man." God NEVER wrote that....... MAN wrote that! Men have been using it against women for thousands of years, to gain power over them.
So as a Jehovah Witness, sex is strictly FORBIDDEN before marriage........There is no sex before marriage and sadly sometimes very little after and since usually the only person you ever have sex with is the first person you had sex with, there is also plenty of sexual incompatibility going on too. That is why more people are kicked out of the JWs every year for sexual reasons than anything else!
Sex out of wedlock.
Sex with someone besides your marriage mate.
Sex with your own kids or other people's kids.
Yep, sex is their biggest problem
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My Bethwl Experience Part 11
by new boy inmore about cars and n.y.c.. .
back then hundreds of cars were stolen, in the city every day!
the new york post said "the average life span of a corvette (sports car) parked on the street was 24 hours!
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new boy
More about cars and N.Y.C.
Back then hundreds of cars were stolen, in the city every day! The New York Post said "The average life span of a Corvette (sports car) parked on the street was 24 hours!"...........One time coming back from R.I at 2:00 a.m. I took a wrong turn in the South Bronx’s.........NOT a place you would want to be in, that time of night. As I was driving around trying to find my way back to the express way, I could see the sparks form the cutting torches, people cutting up the cars they stolen the day before. I was Praying "Please God get me out of here"
We would see the cars that broke down on the Brooklyn Bridge the night before. They were pushed to the end of the off ramp. We would pass them on our way to the factory at 7:45 a.m.........they had no tires...........pass them again going to lunch.............no trunk or doors.............pass them on our way home that night..........no engine or seats............next day, it was just the shell sitting there.
A Brother in my Hall, got a flat tire on the BQE (Brooklyn Queens Express Way) A road, that back then had so many pot holes in it........you would swear it was shelled by mortars......Any way, he gets out of the car and starts jacking up the back end. Just then.........a car pulls up in front of him and 4 black guys jump out and before he could say a word, they start jacking up the front end of his car.........."HEY what are you doing" he asked ............."HEY MOTHER F.....KER!..........YOU GET THE BACK TWO ...........AND WE WILL GET THE FRONT TWO"......they said ........"But this is MY car".......he said .........."yeah?"...they said ......"YES" he said..........10 seconds later they were down the road, looking for more parts. This is a true story.
They didn't always have to work on that Saturday mornings at Bethel. An exBethelite told me that back in the 50’s that some Bethelites jump in their car Friday night after work and tried to drive to Chicago and be back for breakfast by Monday morning. They didn't make it and they crashed their car and three of them died. So Knorr figured that if they had been working, that would have never happen. New light, work on Saturday mornings. That man was a genius.
My soon to be brother in-law Mike Stillman.......had a 1946 orange pickup truck with a camper on the back, made out of old barn wood .........the camper door looked like an old out house door, with a half-moon on the back.....and above the door it said ......."KEEP ON TRUCKING".......Calvin Chyke hauled him into his office one day and told him, that he was a disgrace to the organization and how dare he put on his truck "KEEP ON TRUCKING" He said that EVERYONE knew that REALLY meant KEEP ON F....KING! Oh.........those brothers they just love to have fun with us. There are two types of people in the "Lord's house" the testers and the testis. He never took it off he was in the ink room and bullet proof.
As Bob Dylan said........"Some of us are prisoners.........and some us are guards."
I was walking to the factory one morning in the winter of 1974. I walked by my car and some kids sprayed painted my car with the words "F....k you" on the front fender. I thought......... did they really mean "Keep on Trucking." I laughed to myself, I wished I had painted it on there instead of them.
Oh yes! I waited until someone said something before I took it off....................."But. Brother I didn't put in on there.”...I said...." "WE KNOW THAT, just get it OFF."
God.........I wish you could have seen my car. I have a picture of her somewhere. "Road Warrior part II" I would drive down the FDR..........Radio on, with Elton John on playing "Rocket Man"......It was like parting the Red Sea.......a 1/2 mile ahead of me......... people in their cars would start moving into the other lanes.
They knew someone was coming, who had NOTHING TO LOSE!
As Bob Dylan said....... "When you got nothing......you got nothing to lose."
Two months before my sentence was up. "I was serving a 1 to 4 for impersonating a minister" ....I was walking to the factory one day, my car was parked next to the park. As I passed I notice that someone had taken a ball peen hammer to my wind shield, right were the driver looks out! As I looked down the street, I saw ALL the cars parked, new and old. ALL of them had their wind shields smashed..............then I looked up the hill..............all were smashed.I counted 53 cars with smashed windshields that morning, someone had some fun the night before!
Well, that was the death blow for my baby.They wanted 85 bucks for a new wind shield. There was no way I could put another dollar into that car.............So I drove it up to Rhode Island (180 miles away) one Saturday, with no wind shield it, it was 25 degrees, heater blasting, hoping the cops didn't pull me over. I parked it at my soon to be in-laws house and parted it out........sold the transmission rear end to a friend, keep the engine and tires.......sold the gas tank to Roy Baty, he welded it into his van, because of the gas crisis, now he could buy 35 gallons of gas at a time. In the end, she looked just liked one of those cars at the bottom of the Brooklyn Bridge.......R.I.P. sweetheart. My first real love!
Next up............... Love and sex in the "Big House"
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My Bethel Experienxce Part 10
by new boy inthere were guys at bethel, who had great jobs........like don brouex.....he was the receptionist at the 124 desk.
his job was checking in and "checking out" all the bethel tours and "hot" sisters on their way through the bethel home.
that my friend, is not a real bethel job.
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new boy
Guys it was a joke . It meant that there was few publishers in the hall. less then twenty including kids, old ladies, dogs and anyone else. -
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What are Strangest Grounds For Disfellowshiping You Have Heard Of?
by new boy inin 1961 my father was disfellowshipped for not doing to the kingdom hall he was assigned to.. if i'm lying...my dying!.
it was the glendora california congeration.
the committee was.. john smoley.
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new boy
I thought I would get this one out of the bone yard. -
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Hello, this is my first post
by noralee inhello, this is my first post, i would like to introduce myself and say thank you to every one on this forum, you have been a lifeline to me these last few years.. i had been a jw for 30 years when i walked away a few years ago disgusted by the treatment victims of child abuse, domestic abuse and rape receive from the wtbts.. at first i thought it was a local problem, elders personal opinions, the way they handled the situations, imperfect men etc., until i checked out jehovahs witnesses and child abuse/domestic abuse online.
that's when i realized they had the same modus operandi worldwide.
that led me here, tbuo this forum, and then to crisis of conscience, jw facts, watchtower documents, jw survey, old watchtower literature and cd s, reading a couple of steve hassans books, and more recently exiting the jw cult.. the feelings of shock, betrayal, anger at the wtbts, angry with myself for being so gullible, depression, reflection, loneliness, have taken their toll.
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new boy
There is a life after the witnesses and it's a great one. Don't feel bad I wasted 52 years worth. That might a record for stupidity. -
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Is the Watchtower organisation facing the biggest crisis of its history?
by slimboyfat inrecent developments make me think they might be.
the problems they are facing are not just lack of funds but also draining authority, and the two could be a heady and explosive mix.
one of the best analyses ever written of the watchtower was a book called "trumpet of prophecy" by sociologist james beckford in the 1970s.
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new boy
Sad but with the sell off of Brooklyn properties for Billions, money may not be a problem for awhile.
Personally I believe their fall will come from the fact they are losing their young people. They have an 1800's religion in a modern world. Kids are smarter today then ever before. With the technology of today kids just have to jump on their computers for 30 minutes and research their parents religion and know it's bull shit. With only 1% to 2% coming from the door to door work and most of the new witnesses coming form JWs having sex with other JWs....their time is numbered. Thank god for the next generation.